Dud 5900x? Return or keep?

[Sir Beregond]

OK @neurotix, here's my settings:

 

I run PBO power limits on "Motherboard", PBO Overdrive offset of +100MHz as any more is unstable with my curve optimizer settings. I then also set the Scaler to 10X.

 

For Curve Optimizer, I do a negative offset per core on the following (please keep in mind, these work for my 5900X and you should NOT just plug these numbers in and expect the same results. It took hours of per core stability/error testing to reach these numbers and yours will most certainly be different).

 

Core 0: -30

Core 1: -30

Core 2: -20

Core 3: -20

Core 4: -30

Core 5: -10

Core 6 -29

Core 7: -27

Core 8: -26

Core 9: -22

Core 10: -30

Core 11: -30

 

Here is my HWInfo64 shot from a CB R23 multi-core run. As you can see it easily boosts to %.05GHz due to the combo of PBO Overdrive offset and curve optimizer undervolting: 

 

 

Not my best score, I've gotten over 23.3k doing an all-core overclock, but you always get the best score for that doing an all-core OC, but my 5900X tops out at 4.65GHz all-core at not a voltage I would feel comfortable running 24/7. In my opinion, for daily use, and gaming, PBO and CO are definitely the way to go.

 

If you really want maximum PBO Overdrive of +200, you can optimize for that too with probably a less aggressive curve optimizer. Anyway, this is what worked for me.

 

One thing I forgot to add, you can download and use Ryzen Master to scan and determine what your best cores are on each CCD of the 5900X. Helps you when optimizing. I don't like trying to change anything setting wise via Ryzen Master though. I think it's still best to use the BIOS. Ryzen Master will also incorrectly tell you you can just set all cores to -30 CO and that's just not true unless you have some supremely divine golden sample.

 

 

Edited November 22, 2022 by Sir Beregond

[neurotix]

Alright, so here's an update.

 

Those low 3733MHz cas14 timings? With 55ns latency in AIDA64? Yeah, go figure, I ran the membench in Ryzen DRAM Calculator to check stability and after a while it had errors on all threads and hard locked my system. The one thing I was happy about since this * chip won't do more than 1866MHz fclk. I figured, oh hey I can run 3733 with tight timings but NOPE

 

I've messed with PBO with both the AMD Overclocking in the advanced menu, as well as PBO in the Extreme Tweaker section, and essentially anything I've tried including undervolting and overvolting the chip, setting +100MHz or +200MHz boost, etc. all get me worse clocks and performance than just going in the PBO menu and enabling PBO and PBO Fmax enhancer. Those get me 4600MHz all core boost in CPU-Z bench or Cinebench, and 4950MHz single thread for the CPU-Z single thread test.

 

I did notice that leaving the Extreme Tweaker settings on Auto, and setting +200MHz and enabling PBO and a 10x scaler in the AMD Overclocking menu got me drastically higher scores in CPU-Z bench, like 9700 multi and 667 single compared to 9300 multi and 640 single using Extreme Tweaker PBO and Fmax enhancer. However, HWINFO64 was showing the clocks as being really low when I just did it through the AMD Overclocking menu, the scores were higher but all core was like 4375MHz instead of 4650MHz and single was 4875MHz instead of 4950MHz.

 

I'm a wizard with memory overclocking on Ryzen but I never could figure out PBO or had any success with it messing with any of the settings besides just turning it on and leaving everything on Auto. Any of the curve optimizer stuff is beyond me but thanks for the settings and advice.

 

TBH I'm really effing (are we allowed to swear here?) pissed off big time over this purchase and this crappy performing chip. I was thinking it would easily do 1900MHz fclk and if I was lucky, a little higher than that and if I was really lucky, 2000MHz. I also thought it would boost to 5GHz+. Cooling is not an issue because even running Cinebench with cores at 4600MHz+ it barely hits 55C. I am seriously considering buying another 5900x and selling this trash dumpster fire silicon on Ebay and taking a loss since I don't think I can return it to Amazon since it's been opened. Let me know if you've ever returned a processor to Amazon or not.

 

Also, how does rep work here and how do I rep someone? Is it just the thanks button?

[damric]

38 minutes ago, neurotix said:

Alright, so here's an update.

 

Those low 3733MHz cas14 timings? With 55ns latency in AIDA64? Yeah, go figure, I ran the membench in Ryzen DRAM Calculator to check stability and after a while it had errors on all threads and hard locked my system. The one thing I was happy about since this * chip won't do more than 1866MHz fclk. I figured, oh hey I can run 3733 with tight timings but NOPE

 

I've messed with PBO with both the AMD Overclocking in the advanced menu, as well as PBO in the Extreme Tweaker section, and essentially anything I've tried including undervolting and overvolting the chip, setting +100MHz or +200MHz boost, etc. all get me worse clocks and performance than just going in the PBO menu and enabling PBO and PBO Fmax enhancer. Those get me 4600MHz all core boost in CPU-Z bench or Cinebench, and 4950MHz single thread for the CPU-Z single thread test.

 

I did notice that leaving the Extreme Tweaker settings on Auto, and setting +200MHz and enabling PBO and a 10x scaler in the AMD Overclocking menu got me drastically higher scores in CPU-Z bench, like 9700 multi and 667 single compared to 9300 multi and 640 single using Extreme Tweaker PBO and Fmax enhancer. However, HWINFO64 was showing the clocks as being really low when I just did it through the AMD Overclocking menu, the scores were higher but all core was like 4375MHz instead of 4650MHz and single was 4875MHz instead of 4950MHz.

 

I'm a wizard with memory overclocking on Ryzen but I never could figure out PBO or had any success with it messing with any of the settings besides just turning it on and leaving everything on Auto. Any of the curve optimizer stuff is beyond me but thanks for the settings and advice.

 

TBH I'm really effing (are we allowed to swear here?) pissed off big time over this purchase and this crappy performing chip. I was thinking it would easily do 1900MHz fclk and if I was lucky, a little higher than that and if I was really lucky, 2000MHz. I also thought it would boost to 5GHz+. Cooling is not an issue because even running Cinebench with cores at 4600MHz+ it barely hits 55C. I am seriously considering buying another 5900x and selling this trash dumpster fire silicon on Ebay and taking a loss since I don't think I can return it to Amazon since it's been opened. Let me know if you've ever returned a processor to Amazon or not.

 

Also, how does rep work here and how do I rep someone? Is it just the thanks button?

Hmmn how much did you pay for that 5900X? I'm tempted to buy it off of you, bum silicon and all

[neurotix]

19 minutes ago, damric said:

Hmmn how much did you pay for that 5900X? I'm tempted to buy it off of you, bum silicon and all

 

We paid $343 and it was something like $373 after tax. Gotten on Amazon.

 

Minor update; in the Extreme Tweaker submenu I tried +150, Pbo Enabled and PBO Fmax enabled and got it to boost to 5.1GHz so that's somewhat of an improvement. Luke, pm me if you're interested in it. Though I'd have to get another one first and make sure its not worse than this one, lol.

[neurotix]

Sorry for double posting. Wife ordered another 5900x from Amazon and it will be here Friday even with Prime because of the holiday.

 

I swear to God, this one damn well better do at least 3800/1900 and possibly better than that and boost higher.

Edited November 22, 2022 by neurotix

[damric]

I remember having terrible luck with AM2 and AM3 processors. I think the only descent one I had was that Phenom II 1090T I sold you. 

[neurotix]

Yeah that one was pretty good and if you used AMD Overdrive you could clock the first two cores to 4.2GHz.

[Sir Beregond]

Good luck. From what I've seen, only golden samples really do 2000MHz fclk, most seem to hit either a hole or a wall at 1900. Some might be able to do 1900, but 2000 was never a guarantee with Zen 3.

 

If it's any consolation mine won't go above 1866 either.

 

Yeah there's a huge time investment in lewrning/testing for CO. Like Pio said, you can try a small vcore undervolt and that should help a little too.

Edited November 23, 2022 by Sir Beregond

[neurotix]

12 hours ago, Sir Beregond said:

Good luck. From what I've seen, only golden samples really do 2000MHz fclk, most seem to hit either a hole or a wall at 1900. Some might be able to do 1900, but 2000 was never a guarantee with Zen 3.

 

If it's any consolation mine won't go above 1866 either.

 

Yeah there's a huge time investment in lewrning/testing for CO. Like Pio said, you can try a small vcore undervolt and that should help a little too.

 

Thanks so much for all your help, in particular. The curve optimizer stuff is beyond me, and I will have tor try different settings under PBO to see about boost. A new 5900x should be here Friday but I have this one to mess around with in the meantime, mostly to try and get it to boost consistently to 5.1 and on more than one thread. Like I said, entering anything (like duplicate settings) into the Advanced -> AMD overclocking menu ends up with garbage results (like 4375mhz all core). It seems PBO and PBO Fmax Enhancer are the way to go.

 

Lets hope I get one that does 1900 fclk at least, if I get another one that only does 1866 I'm done.

 

Edited November 23, 2022 by neurotix

[Sir Beregond]

3 hours ago, neurotix said:

 

Thanks so much for all your help, in particular. The curve optimizer stuff is beyond me, and I will have tor try different settings under PBO to see about boost. A new 5900x should be here Friday but I have this one to mess around with in the meantime, mostly to try and get it to boost consistently to 5.1 and on more than one thread. Like I said, entering anything (like duplicate settings) into the Advanced -> AMD overclocking menu ends up with garbage results (like 4375mhz all core). It seems PBO and PBO Fmax Enhancer are the way to go.

 

Lets hope I get one that does 1900 fclk at least, if I get another one that only does 1866 I'm done.

 

So my CO settings above I guess are not as stable as I thought. Had a crash last night while gaming so I just turned it back off and put my PBO settings back to +200 and CO on Auto. I will then need to just do a vcore undervolt I guess and see what that gets me as I am back to just boosting to 4950MHz, same as you.

Edited November 23, 2022 by Sir Beregond

[neurotix]

8 minutes ago, Sir Beregond said:

So my CO settings above I guess are not as stable as I thought. Had a crash last night while gaming so I just turned it back off and put my PBO settings back to +200 and CO on Auto. I will then need to just do a vcore undervolt I guess and see what that gets me as I am back to just boosting to 4950MHz, same as you.

 

CO = Curve Optimizer?

 

Also, do you leave the Extreme Tweaker settings alone and do all the PBO stuff in the AMD Overclocking menu? (Guessing not since CO is in Extreme Tweaker) I'm about to try seeing if I can get this thing boosting higher. There was ONE time with certain settings where I saw my CPU hit 5150 when I just had HWINFO64 and CPU-Z open, and it hard locked my machine. This was when I did +200.

 

I've been OCing using Extreme Tweaker and PBO Enabled, PBO Fmax enabled and I add +200 but it doesn't seem to affect all core clocks which seem to stay at 4650MHz even adding +150 (which should get me 4800 all core boost), but it does affect single core boost speed.

 

I've always had trouble any time I've messed with the PBO settings, I don't get the expected results.

[Sir Beregond]

6 minutes ago, neurotix said:

 

CO = Curve Optimizer?

 

Also, do you leave the Extreme Tweaker settings alone and do all the PBO stuff in the AMD Overclocking menu? (Guessing not since CO is in Extreme Tweaker) I'm about to try seeing if I can get this thing boosting higher. There was ONE time with certain settings where I saw my CPU hit 5150 when I just had HWINFO64 and CPU-Z open, and it hard locked my machine. This was when I did +200.

 

I've been OCing using Extreme Tweaker and PBO Enabled, PBO Fmax enabled and I add +200 but it doesn't seem to affect all core clocks which seem to stay at 4650MHz even adding +150 (which should get me 4800 all core boost), but it does affect single core boost speed.

 

I've always had trouble any time I've messed with the PBO settings, I don't get the expected results.

Curve Optimer = CO, yes.

 

CO is in the AMD Overclocking menu. I don't do a thing in the Extreme Tweaker menu aside from adjusting voltages, doing DOCP settings, etc. All PBO/CO stuff I touch is in AMD Overclocking. I really do not recommend Extreme Tweaker menu for PBO/CO.

 

Seems off to me you had worse performance using that vs Extreme Tweaker. It's usually the opposite.

Edited November 23, 2022 by Sir Beregond

[neurotix]

So here's what's going on. The first set of settings are PBO through the AMD Overclocking menu and my HWINFO while running CPU-Z bench. 2nd settings are my results from the Extreme Tweaker menu and HWINFO. This was from the all-core bench. For whatever reason, adding +150 in Extreme Tweaker does not affect all core boost, only single thread boost and I'm lucky to see 5100 MHz. With +150 you'd think my all core result would be 4800mhz but nope. It maxes out at 4650Mhz. Undervolting just makes the chip boost lower.

 

Also, adding positive offset vcore of 0.025v causes the system to hard lock and I think its from the cores exceeding 5100MHz.

 

None of this matters that much really, as I'll be putting a new 5900x in on Friday. Let's hope I get a better one. Anyone ever returned an open box processor to Amazon?

Edited November 23, 2022 by neurotix

[Sir Beregond]

On 23/11/2022 at 12:50, neurotix said:

Also, adding positive offset vcore of 0.025v causes the system to hard lock and I think its from the cores exceeding 5100MHz.

 

None of this matters that much really, as I'll be putting a new 5900x in on Friday. Let's hope I get a better one. Anyone ever returned an open box processor to Amazon?

 

You don't want a positive offset. You'll want a negative one. Try 0.025v, maybe more, or less. How much were you undervolting? I really think you have some conflict between the Extreme Tweaker settings and AMD Overclock settings. What you describe just doesn't sound right at all in terms of how it's acting. Slight undervolt should absolutely be giving you higher boosts, not lower boosts. I have gone as high as 5150MHz boosts with PBO/undervolting. Just because cores are hitting 5100MHz, shouldn't in and of itself hard lock you, so something screwy is going on that's making this not stable.

 

I'll doublecheck what my other voltage settings are when I get home again today.

 

I'd say when you get the new chip, do a CMOS reset and start with a fresh BIOS. So probably save or write down whatever tweaks you've made for your RAM if your RAM has been stable. Though depending on what your new chip can do for fclk, might be reworking that anyway. 

 

Can't say I've ever bought a processor on Amazon. I'm one of those lucky people with a Micro Center within 40 minutes of me.

Edited November 25, 2022 by Sir Beregond

[neurotix]

2 hours ago, Sir Beregond said:

 

You don't want a positive offset. You'll want a negative one. Try 0.025v, maybe more, or less. How much were you undervolting? I really think you have some conflict between the Extreme Tweaker settings and AMD Overclock settings. What you describe just doesn't sound right at all in terms of how it's acting. Slight undervolt should absolutely be giving you higher boosts, not lower boosts. I have gone as high as 5150MHz boosts with PBO/undervolting. Just because cores are hitting 5100MHz, shouldn't in and of itself hard lock you, so something screwy is going on that's making this not stable.

 

I'll doublecheck what my other voltage settings are when I get home again today.

 

I'd say when you get the new chip, do a CMOS reset and start with a fresh BIOS. So probably save or write down whatever tweaks you've made for your RAM if your RAM has been stable. Though depending on what your new chip can do for fclk, might be reworking that anyway. 

 

Can't say I've ever bought a processor on Amazon. I'm one of those lucky people with a Micro Center within 40 minutes of me.

 

 

The screenshots I provided had voltage on Auto, no undervolt or overvolt. I have been entering settings in either one or the other (Extreme Tweaker PBO menu or Advanced -> AMD Overclocking menu), not both at the same time. As shown, when entering what I think are the correct settings you provided in the AMD Overclocking menu, I get 4375MHz all-core boost and 4800~MHz single core boost.

 

Entering the settings I showed in Extreme Tweaker gives me 4650MHz all core and 5050-5100 single core boost with +200 (it doesn't affect multicore? Maybe I should try turning PBO Fmax enhancer off). I don't have the new processor or have it in yet, but I'm going to try your settings in AMD Overclocking menu with a 0.025 undervolt.

 

The 5100 boost DID hard lock me, I had HWINFO64 open and opened CPU-Z and as CPU-Z was opening I saw one of my cores hit 5100 in HWINFO and the system hard locked- frozen screen and mouse cursor. Ctrl Alt Del did nothing. Had to press reset.

 

I have always had pretty junk results trying to do PBO through the AMD Overclocking menu. Maybe it's my particular board or something. Doing it via Extreme Tweaker provides much better results but I'll keep trying.

 

I always clear CMOS by doing "load optimized defaults" before installing a new CPU.

 

I am also set when it comes to memory timings and stuff because I have a print off (actually multiple from when I tried to get 4000MHz/2000MHz fclk) from Ryzen DRAM Calculator with the timings and settings I ran my 3900x at for years (at 3800/1900 fclk)

 

Also, thanks again for taking the time to help me with this. I really, really appreciate it.

[Sir Beregond]

2 hours ago, neurotix said:

 

 

The screenshots I provided had voltage on Auto, no undervolt or overvolt. I have been entering settings in either one or the other (Extreme Tweaker PBO menu or Advanced -> AMD Overclocking menu), not both at the same time. As shown, when entering what I think are the correct settings you provided in the AMD Overclocking menu, I get 4375MHz all-core boost and 4800~MHz single core boost.

 

Entering the settings I showed in Extreme Tweaker gives me 4650MHz all core and 5050-5100 single core boost with +200 (it doesn't affect multicore? Maybe I should try turning PBO Fmax enhancer off). I don't have the new processor or have it in yet, but I'm going to try your settings in AMD Overclocking menu with a 0.025 undervolt.

 

The 5100 boost DID hard lock me, I had HWINFO64 open and opened CPU-Z and as CPU-Z was opening I saw one of my cores hit 5100 in HWINFO and the system hard locked- frozen screen and mouse cursor. Ctrl Alt Del did nothing. Had to press reset.

 

I have always had pretty junk results trying to do PBO through the AMD Overclocking menu. Maybe it's my particular board or something. Doing it via Extreme Tweaker provides much better results but I'll keep trying.

 

I always clear CMOS by doing "load optimized defaults" before installing a new CPU.

 

I am also set when it comes to memory timings and stuff because I have a print off (actually multiple from when I tried to get 4000MHz/2000MHz fclk) from Ryzen DRAM Calculator with the timings and settings I ran my 3900x at for years (at 3800/1900 fclk)

 

Also, thanks again for taking the time to help me with this. I really, really appreciate it.

Keep in mind, boosts of 5GHz or more is just that...boosts of 1,2, maybe more cores at a time if they are good enough. It's not an all-core boosts, that would be impossible without sub-ambient cooling. Like I said before, max I can get all-core is 4.65GHz and that's at the threshold of voltage/thermals to get.

 

Yeah, maybe you did have a 5900X that just didn't have the best silicon. Seems extremely strange to me that an undervolt gave you lower clocks.

 

Just looking at your screenshots again...do you have Curve Optimizer just set to "Auto" or how is that being handled?

Edited November 25, 2022 by Sir Beregond

[neurotix]

40 minutes ago, Sir Beregond said:

Keep in mind, boosts of 5GHz or more is just that...boosts of 1,2, maybe more cores at a time if they are good enough. It's not an all-core boosts, that would be impossible without sub-ambient cooling. Like I said before, max I can get all-core is 4.65GHz and that's at the threshold of voltage/thermals to get.

 

Yeah, maybe you did have a 5900X that just didn't have the best silicon. Seems extremely strange to me that an undervolt gave you lower clocks.

 

Just looking at your screenshots again...do you have Curve Optimizer just set to "Auto" or how is that being handled?

 

CO is on Auto, yes.

[neurotix]

Alright, new chip is in, preliminary testing leads me to believe there was something wrong/defective with the other one I had.

 

The new chip also will not do anything above 1866MHz Fclk (I have not tried adding SoC voltage beyond 1.125v though) HOWEVER with the RAM at 3733MHz on this chip with all the same timings I get 56ns latency in AIDA64 vs 58ns with the other chip.

 

All I've done so far is enable PBO and PBO Fmax Enhancer in Extreme Tweaker, and I am getting all-core boost of 4750MHz, which causes my system to hit 70C and all my fans to hit 100%. With the old one and those two features enabled, it would only hit 4650MHz and sit at 55C with plenty of thermal headroom, and nothing I did in either PBO menu would get me all core boosts more than 4650MHz. As a result, my CPU-Z multicore score is a few hundred points higher, I have not tried Cinebench R23 yet.

 

Single core it is still only boosting to 4950MHz (I have not added +200 in the Extreme Tweaker menu) yet I get a single core score in CPU-Z bench that's 30 points higher than with the previous chip.

 

So far, I'm happy (just wish I could overclock my RAM higher) and will have more time to play around with it next week.

Edited November 26, 2022 by neurotix

[Sir Beregond]

3 hours ago, neurotix said:

Alright, new chip is in, preliminary testing leads me to believe there was something wrong/defective with the other one I had.

 

The new chip also will not do anything above 1866MHz Fclk (I have not tried adding SoC voltage beyond 1.125v though) HOWEVER with the RAM at 3733MHz on this chip with all the same timings I get 56ns latency in AIDA64 vs 58ns with the other chip.

 

All I've done so far is enable PBO and PBO Fmax Enhancer in Extreme Tweaker, and I am getting all-core boost of 4750MHz, which causes my system to hit 70C and all my fans to hit 100%. With the old one and those two features enabled, it would only hit 4650MHz and sit at 55C with plenty of thermal headroom, and nothing I did in either PBO menu would get me all core boosts more than 4650MHz. As a result, my CPU-Z multicore score is a few hundred points higher, I have not tried Cinebench R23 yet.

 

Single core it is still only boosting to 4950MHz (I have not added +200 in the Extreme Tweaker menu) yet I get a single core score in CPU-Z bench that's 30 points higher than with the previous chip.

 

So far, I'm happy (just wish I could overclock my RAM higher) and will have more time to play around with it next week.

Definitely seems like a better chip!

[neurotix]

So, even with 1.25v SoC I was unable to get the system to post at 3800/1900 fclk. Oh well. Shattered dreams of 4000/2000, and I know my RAM is capable of it.

 

I added +200 in Extreme Tweaker menu, again with PBO Fmax enhancer on and PBO on and left voltage on Auto and I'm still getting all core boosts of 4700MHz+, but now am also getting rare single core boosts of 5150MHz.

 

I am curious about how to use the curve optimizer and how to test it, if someone could link a guide or if Sir Beregond could take time to explain, I would love to see all core boosts of 4850MHz like yours and 5100MHz more often. Thanks in advance.

[Sir Beregond]

4 hours ago, neurotix said:

So, even with 1.25v SoC I was unable to get the system to post at 3800/1900 fclk. Oh well. Shattered dreams of 4000/2000, and I know my RAM is capable of it.

 

I added +200 in Extreme Tweaker menu, again with PBO Fmax enhancer on and PBO on and left voltage on Auto and I'm still getting all core boosts of 4700MHz+, but now am also getting rare single core boosts of 5150MHz.

 

I am curious about how to use the curve optimizer and how to test it, if someone could link a guide or if Sir Beregond could take time to explain, I would love to see all core boosts of 4850MHz like yours and 5100MHz more often. Thanks in advance.

I mostly followed this video. He conceptualizes what Curve Optimizer does pretty well and the concept of tuning for maximum boosts vs maximum curve. Again, don't copy his settings, but its a good way to learn what does what.

 

I put my CO back to auto for now. Seems my config I posted earlier still has some instability in it.

 

 

Edited November 27, 2022 by Sir Beregond

[neurotix]

Hey Sir Beregond, I'm wondering if you could post your AIDA64 cache and memory results if you have the app and a key.

 

I have what seems to be very low Memory Copy results, at least compared to my 3900x where Memory Copy was about as fast or faster than memory read. It was 60/58/62 (Read, Write and Copy)

 

Currently with my 5900x its 58/58/52 and I'm wondering why my memory copy is so low.

 

Thanks for any help in advance @Sir Beregond

[Sir Beregond]

4 minutes ago, neurotix said:

Hey Sir Beregond, I'm wondering if you could post your AIDA64 cache and memory results if you have the app and a key.

 

I have what seems to be very low Memory Copy results, at least compared to my 3900x where Memory Copy was about as fast or faster than memory read. It was 60/58/62 (Read, Write and Copy)

 

Currently with my 5900x its 58/58/52 and I'm wondering why my memory copy is so low.

 

Thanks for any help in advance @Sir Beregond

I don't think I have that tool, but will take a look after work today.

[neurotix]

2 hours ago, Sir Beregond said:

I don't think I have that tool, but will take a look after work today.

 Ok thanks. To note, the free version will not show memory copy I think, it'll say trial in a bunch of the boxes. So you'll need a key or other means...

 

Once the program opens its in one of the drop-down menus on the right side and is "Cache and Memory Benchmark"

[neurotix]

Hey Sir Beregond, did you ever get around to this? Getting Aida64 and running the memory test. Still wondering why my copy bandwidth is so low and since I believe you said you run your RAM at the same speed as me, I am very curious if your copy bandwidth is higher or not.

 

@Sir Beregond