Numba WAN in the world.

[The Pook]

I've never had to reapply but everything I've delidded got sold or given away before the 2 year mark 

 

my 10900K is coming up on a year and it doesn't need to be redone. 

[Bastiaan_NL]

Just now, The Pook said:

I've never had to reapply but everything I've delidded got sold or given away before the 2 year mark 

 

my 10900K is coming up on a year and it doesn't need to be redone. 

My 7700k has the same LM from years ago and is still fine, though I never really stress it

 

16 minutes ago, iamjanco said:

 

Great stuff (and again, congrats!)! Got some questions:

 

1. How long is the Conductonaut application typically good for (length of time between refreshes)? 
2. Do you use Conductonaut on the outside of the copper ihs as well (between the block and the top of the ihs)?
3. Do you change out the copper ihs with a new one each delid/refresh?
4. Which block are you using? Copper, nickel plated, etc.?

 

You've probably mentioned the answers to all of these in one place or another already; but my old eyes have been tiring out quickly lately and I'm afraid I'm going to need a cane to get around my workbench before too long  .  As always, TIA!

Thanks, though I'm in third already

 

As for the questions, never hesitate to ask them and now you have all the answers in one post:

1. Technically it shouldn't dry out, but it does react with almost every metal out there. As far as I'm concerned you could let it sit as long as your temps are fine, and if you do a major system overhaul you can always redo it.
2. I use Kryonout Extreme between the waterblock and the IHS, I've never tried LM and if I would I'll have to lap everything to a mirror finish for sure!
3. I don't think you'd have to change the IHS after a refresh, but this Rockitcool IHS has more surface area and is pure copper so it should be a decent upgrade over the stock IHS.
4. I'm using a Watercool Heatkiller IV copper block which has been lapped, there were a few deep spots in the block.

[Avacado]

1 hour ago, iamjanco said:

 

Great stuff (and again, congrats!)! Got some questions:

 

1. How long is the Conductonaut application typically good for (length of time between refreshes)? 
2. Do you use Conductonaut on the outside of the copper ihs as well (between the block and the top of the ihs)?
3. Do you change out the copper ihs with a new one each delid/refresh?
4. Which block are you using? Copper, nickel plated, etc.?

 

You've probably mentioned the answers to all of these in one place or another already; but my old eyes have been tiring out quickly lately and I'm afraid I'm going to need a cane to get around my workbench before too long  .  As always, TIA!

 

 

 

 

 

1. AFAIK LM does not dry out. Should be fine for years.

2. You apply a small layer to the bare die and the IHS surface as well where the die will contact the IHS.

3. No, besides staining copper, LM has no effect on the cooling capability from use to use. I have multiple uses on an optimus block with numerous LM applications. No temp differences. 

4. The rockitcool blocks are Copper only. I did not notice a nickel variant.

[J7SC_Orion]

1 hour ago, Avacado said:

1. AFAIK LM does not dry out. Should be fine for years.

2. You apply a small layer to the bare die and the IHS surface as well where the die will contact the IHS.

3. No, besides staining copper, LM has no effect on the cooling capability from use to use. I have multiple uses on an optimus block with numerous LM applications. No temp differences. 

4. The rockitcool blocks are Copper only. I did not notice a nickel variant.

 

Generally, LM tends to stay 'flexible' for several years, in my experience. However, I had an extra NEVER opened Coolaboratory LM tube still in its original, sealed packaging that I finally opened six years after I got it - I was solid / hard metal by then.

[Mr. Fox]

On 16/04/2022 at 08:03, Avacado said:

Very low risk if you pre-heat the cpu to 60-80c with a heat gun before delidding. I had never done so before the 12900KF and it made it substantially less hard this time around. Was able to use my re-work station heat gun on the hole in the delid kit. Was a perfect fit. 

 

On 16/04/2022 at 09:18, Bastiaan_NL said:

I tried preheating the IHS but the hole in the delid tool is too little for my heatgun. Even without heating it was not bad, though it's a bit scary at first.

I will be joining the 12900K delid party. The kit arrived a day earlier than expected. Now, I need to get a direct die setup when stock becomes available again.

[Mr. Fox]

Well, I got the delid done. Definite improvement, although not as amazing as I had hoped. My temps were already better than most I have seen, so that probably has something to do with it because there was less room for improvement.

 

I have historically had better temps with the stock IHS than I have using a Copper IHS. Unfortunately, the delid tool caused damage to the stock IHS. In order to use it I will need to lap it to fix the damage, which sucks because the main reason to have an aftermarket IHS is to keep the stock one looking new. Lapping it would totally defeat the purpose for buying an aftermarket IHS. 

 

I am not sure if the IHS deformation is because the 12th Gen IHS is softer metal than prior generations, if it is because it takes more force to break the solder joint, or if the RockitCool delid tool isn't made correctly. Nothing in terms of user error could cause it because all you do it put it in the pocket and tighten the lid down snugly. I also heated the IHS to soften the solder.

 

 

Edited April 21, 2022 by Mr. Fox

[ArchStanton]

@Mr. Fox Sorry it wasn't everything one might hope for, but as you said, 5-7 degrees less isn't pocket change.  

[The Pook]

9 minutes ago, Mr. Fox said:

Well, I got the delid done. Definite improvement, although not as amazing as I had hoped. My temps were already better than most I have seen, so that probably has something to do with it because there was less room for improvement.

 

I have historically had better temps with the stock IHS than I have using a Copper IHS. Unfortunately, the delid tool caused damage to the stock IHS. In order to use it I will need to lap it to fix the damage, which sucks because the main reason to have an aftermarket IHS is to keep the stock one looking new. Lapping it would totally defeat the purpose for buying an aftermarket IHS. 

 

I am not sure if the IHS deformation is because the 12th Gen IHS is softer metal than prior generations, if it is because it takes more force to break the solder joint, or if the RockitCool delid tool isn't made correctly. Nothing in terms of user error could cause it because all you do it put it in the pocket and tighten the lid down snugly. I also heated the IHS to soften the solder.

 

 

 

what fan is "chassis #6"? a 7c drop with a 200 RPM fan speed drop and 1F higher ambient seems pretty decent to me. 

[Mr. Fox]

3 minutes ago, The Pook said:

 

what fan is "chassis #6"? a 7c drop with a 200 RPM fan speed drop and 1F higher ambient seems pretty decent to me. 

That fan is a 120mm that I have blowing air over the memory modules, with the fan curve set in the BIOS to react based on CPU temperature. So, it does make sense that the speed was a bit less with the lower CPU temperature.

9 minutes ago, ArchStanton said:

@Mr. Fox Sorry it wasn't everything one might hope for, but as you said, 5-7 degrees less isn't pocket change.  

I am pleased with everything except for the stock IHS being ruined. (By ruined, I mean the only way I can fix it is by lapping and thereby erasing all of the factory identification on the IHS. That kind of pisses me off a little bit.) But, 5-7°C actually is a really decent temperature drop and probably would have been a degree or two better with the stock IHS. I find my temps are always 1 or 2 degrees higher with a RockitCool IHS than they are with the stock IHS except for a laptop. The Clevo laptops with a desktop CPU benefit a lot more because of the flatness of the copper IHS mating better with a flat laptop heat sink. Everything will be even better once I have the parts needed for bare die.

[Bastiaan_NL]

Sorry to hear about the damage to the IHS, but 5-7°C is not bad

It seems like the little push block from the delid tool slipped over the finger below and damaged your IHS like that because it shouldn't be touching the top part where the IHS meets the cooler.

 

It's easy to slide the push block around, so while I installed the first delid victim it was almost on the IHS instead of next to it.

 

 

The G7400 is now delidded too, and I lapped the copper IHS to be sure it was as flat as I want it to be (which it was)

Edited April 21, 2022 by Bastiaan_NL

[Mr. Fox]

1 minute ago, Bastiaan_NL said:

Sorry to hear about the damage to the IHS, but 5-7°C is not bad

It seems like the little push block from the delid tool slipped over the finger below and damaged your IHS like that because it shouldn't be touching the top part that where the IHS meets the cooler.

Yes, that is the only way it could have happened. The clamshell was fully closed with the screws tightened before I slid the block against the IHS and tightened the large "push" bolt, so it seems like maybe there is some room for improvement on the tool itself. This is my fourth RockitCool delid tool (I have them for two prior generations plus socket 2011/Skylake-X) and I have never seen this occur until now. I generally see 10-15°C temperature reduction, but 5-7°C is still very good. I view that as meaning the original IHS solder job was likely better quality than prior CPU generations and probably also an indicator that my cooling system is performing very well. I also suspect the improvement in core max temp will be more pronounced with the chilled water, as that is usually the case.

[Alastair]

On 04/12/2021 at 00:55, Avacado said:

Whelp, iv'e done just about all I can. I am #2 rookie overclocker in the world right now. Some dude from France came and blew me out of the water and I should have had 1st. Will possibly get Alder Lake and see if I can compete again. I am looking to get more members active in HWbot. I know @Bastiaan_NLis getting back into it. 

 

 

Have #11 9900k in the world for Cinebench R23. I know I could get way better than this, but I am terrible with mem overclocking. Most of the people ahead of me have lower core OC's, but better mem speeds/timings. I know I could get top 5 if I had some help here. 

 

I thought I saw you up there. I am on HW bot as well. Been pushing for some results out of my hardware.  I got myself a 5594 in Superposition 1080p extreme which is good enough for 3rd place with a Vega 64, and a few other benches. But that's about it. I have a whole 1 point for the round 1 Div 2 competition.  So yay. 

 

https://hwbot.org/user/alastair_s1d/

[Avacado]

41 minutes ago, Alastair said:

I thought I saw you up there. I am on HW bot as well. Been pushing for some results out of my hardware.  I got myself a 5594 in Superposition 1080p extreme which is good enough for 3rd place with a Vega 64, and a few other benches. But that's about it. I have a whole 1 point for the round 1 Div 2 competition.  So yay. 

 

https://hwbot.org/user/alastair_s1d/

Happy to help getting you where you need to be. @Bastiaan_NL and @PCSarge can lend support. I will be on our discord heavily this weekend to get some reviews going and would be willing to assist you if you need it. 

 

What is the time difference from EST to South Africa?

Edited April 21, 2022 by Avacado

[Bastiaan_NL]

1 hour ago, Avacado said:

Happy to help getting you where you need to be. @Bastiaan_NL and @PCSarge can lend support. I will be on our discord heavily this weekend to get some reviews going and would be willing to assist you if you need it. 

 

What is the time difference from EST to South Africa?

Google tells me it's 6 hours, which means it's the same as my time  

[Alastair]

4 hours ago, Avacado said:

Happy to help getting you where you need to be. @Bastiaan_NL and @PCSarge can lend support. I will be on our discord heavily this weekend to get some reviews going and would be willing to assist you if you need it. 

 

What is the time difference from EST to South Africa?

I can't see anyway I can improve my scores honestly. I'm as high as I can go on cpu for the cinebench R15 score. Can't do much  better on Ambient water. My PY prime is limited by my rather mediocre 3600mhz c die. The same goes for my geek bench single core. I've got the number 1 spot in R23 for 3800Xs so it's not like my single core scores are bad. But I can't compete with overclocked 5000 series chips. 

[PCSarge]

On 21/04/2022 at 18:01, Alastair said:

I can't see anyway I can improve my scores honestly. I'm as high as I can go on cpu for the cinebench R15 score. Can't do much  better on Ambient water. My PY prime is limited by my rather mediocre 3600mhz c die. The same goes for my geek bench single core. I've got the number 1 spot in R23 for 3800Xs so it's not like my single core scores are bad. But I can't compete with overclocked 5000 series chips. 

numer 1 isnt just the name of the game(unless your avacado and bastian), pushing the best scores you can out of what you own is and having fun along the way

[Mr. Fox]

So, just for giggles I did that washer mod thing that has been talked about relating to the 12th Gen ILM crushing the CPU into a banana shape. I used some M4 1mm thick  nylon washers, and it did lower the temps a bit, even after a delid with the copper IHS. I started the stress test and left at 3 minutes in to run to the store, and got back after the test had run for a total of 40 minutes. I put this into a side-by-side for ease of viewing. It was certainly easier to latch with the washers in there. It was so tight before that it almost felt like something is going to get broken before you can latch it down.

 

[Mr. Fox]

Seems like she is running pretty decent...

 

Numba 2 for 12900K wPrime32M with Benchmate

/img/logo.png

Mr. Fox`s wPrime - 32m with BenchMate score: 1sec 431ms with a Core i9 12900K

HWBOT.ORG

---

The Core i9 12900K @ 5500MHzscores getScoreFormatted in the wPrime - 32m with BenchMate benchmark. Mr. Foxranks #9 worldwide and #2 in the hardware class. Find out more at HWBOT.

/img/logo.png

Mr. Fox`s Cinebench - R20 with BenchMate score: 12022 cb with a Core i9 12900K

HWBOT.ORG

---

The Core i9 12900K @ 5516.1MHzscores getScoreFormatted in the Cinebench - R20 with BenchMate benchmark. Mr. Foxranks #null worldwide and #16 in the hardware class. Find out more at HWBOT.

[Bastiaan_NL]

Nice @Mr. Fox, I should do that washer mod too next time I take a CPU out of the socket. Just need to find a few nylon washers in this mess called "office"

 

[EHW Ai]

More toyz that'll test your 'contentment'

 

 

 

[Bastiaan_NL]

Thanks for sharing! 
I love how they come up with great stuff like this, will try this out for sure

[J7SC_Orion]

38 minutes ago, Bastiaan_NL said:

Thanks for sharing! 
I love how they come up with great stuff like this, will try this out for sure

...

[Avacado]

1 hour ago, iamjanco said:

More toyz that'll test your 'contentment'

 

 

 

No one likes a tease Jan. Not available yet.

[EHW Ai]

39 minutes ago, Avacado said:

No one likes a tease Jan. Not available yet.

 

 

Edited April 24, 2022 by iamjanco

[ArchStanton]

Robin Hood was my favorite animated film growing up.  Couldn't not comment when Sir Hiss appeared on my screen.